CWE Core Humanities

15 responses so far ↓

• 1    Janice // May 7, 2009 at 12:56 pm

  I agree with Shinn that O’Connor exhibits “and he may well be forced to take even more violent means to get his vision across to the hostile environment”(59) We find this in O’Connors story when Julian looks for a response from his mother when he sits next to the black man on the bus. Julian wanted his reaction from his mother. Julians mothers reaction was as he did this “her face turned an angry red. He stared, ather making his eyes the eyes of a stranger”(455). He wanted his mother to get pissed and bothered by this as a way in his mind for her to get upset at him.

  I agree with Brober that Nietzche displays the message that “there is a frequent theme in Nietzches writings for example, “the most common lie is the lie one tells to oneself, lying to others is relatively the exception”(64)
  In Nietzche’s argument about ressentiment he explains that “this need to direct ones views outward instead of back to oneself.”(425) Ressentiment leads to putting some sort of blame that your angry with rather than on yourself.

• 2    gravesangel617 // May 7, 2009 at 9:12 pm

  I agree with Shinn that O’Connor used “violence to convey her vision, because she knew that the violence of rejection in the modern world demands an equal violence of redemption.” (Shinn 58) We see this in O’Connor’s story “Everything That Rises Must Converge” when the black woman from the bus strikes Julian’s mother. “Then all at once she [the black woman] seemed to explode like a piece of machinery that had been given one ounce of pressure too much. Julian saw the black fist swing out with the red pocketbook.” (O’Conner 452). The woman stood up agains the wrongful action that she believed Julian’s mother was creating when she gives the woman’s son a penny.

  I also agree with Brobjer that when he says that for Nietzsche, “the value of a man is determined by his attitude toward life — he must not be filled with resentment and vanity but should have a full and overflowing personality.” (Brobjer 70) For Nietzsche this is characteristic of the masters, the “good” men of master morality. Nietzsche describes their nature as possessing “a powerful physicality, a flourishing, abundant, even overflowing health, together which that which serves to preserve it: war, adventure, hunting, dancing, war games, and in general all that involves vigorous, free, joyful activity.” (Nietzsche 413). For Nietzsche these are the physical signs of the superior and valuable man, the one who is able to “endure distress, want, bad weather, sickness, toil, solitude [...] and stand forth as [he] was born, unbreakable, tensed, ready for new, remoter, even harder things.” (Nietzsche 422-23) This is what Nietzsche is hoping for, the “man who justifies man.” (423)

• 3    noellie // May 8, 2009 at 12:20 pm

  I agree with Thomas H. Brobjer that Nietzsche suggests that “Moral principles, even relativistic moral principles, assume or presuppose moral opposites, presuppose good and evil things, thought and deeds” (65). We find this when “The slave revolt in morality begins when resentment itself becomes creative and gives birth to values.” (416-417). Nietzsche meant that from resentment came values such as Slave morality and Nobel morality and these values presupposed good and evil things.

  I agree with Thelma J Shinn That Flannery O’Connor Confirms that “Miss O’Connor use violence to convey her vision……. of rejection in the modern world demands and equal violence of redemption—man needs to be “struck” by mercy; God must overpower him. And man must reach God through an equal violence” (58). We find this in “The huge woman turned…, her shoulders lifted and her face frozen with frustrated rage…” “Then…explode like a piece of machinery…” “The black fist swing out with the red pocketbook” (52). This confirms that Miss O’ Connor used violent means and the women’s frustration to convey that” Everything that rises must converge.” The women’s frustration showed when her fist meet with Julian mothers face.

• 4    Gabriela // May 9, 2009 at 9:49 am

  I agree with Thomas H. Brobjer that Nietzsche exhibits “the values and evaluating as the ultimate nature of man… no people could live without evaluating” (66). We can find this in the O’Connor story. When the bus had stopped, a gentleman got on the bus. He was “well dressed and carried a briefcase.” Right away the mother spoke softly to her son saying he is the reason why she didn’t take the bus at night. The mother judged that man assuming he was trouble.

  I agree with Shinn that O’Connor display “redemption is possible only through an extreme act, an act of absolute, irrevocable sacrifice” (59). We can find this in Nietzsche’s slave morality. Nietzsche’ slave morality shows that a person must be humble, kind and giving in order for salvation. A person who demonstrates what the slave morality identifies as “bad” which is power, strength and arrogance, can become “good” under the slave morality if they redeem him/ her self.

• 5    Hyejin Lim // May 10, 2009 at 10:47 pm

  I agree with Shinn that O’Connor exhibits “they are so completely a part of the physical world that they simply cannot comprehend the spiritual world.”"Most of Miss O’Connor’s female characters fall into this catefoty.”(62) we find this in when Julian and his mother was on the bus. There was a black man on the bus. In this part, we can see that his mother doesn’t like black people. She said, “Now you see shy I won’t ride on these buses by myself.”(455)

  I agree with Brobjer displays that Nietzsche “Ome of the most common dichotomies made in respect to moral judgements is that they must be based on either the consequences of an act or the intentions of the acting person.” (64) We find this that Nietzsch has two moralities which is Noble Morality and Slave Morality. We can see that the Noble Morality was developed by Doer.

• 6    anacabral // May 11, 2009 at 9:35 am

  I agree with Shinn that O’Connor displays that “redemption is possible only through an extreme act, an act of absolute, irrevocable sacrifice.” We find this in O’Connor’s “Everything that rises must converge” when “Julian saw the black fist swing out with the red pocketbook.” Subsequently the same black woman who had punched Julian’s mom responded and said, “He don’t take nobody’s pennies!” This stern statement which was aimed at Julian’s mother redeemed her because neither she nor her son had to tolerate any longer the pity of any white person. This extreme act could have had her jailed but only through this “…irrevocable sacrifice…” could she have a sense of redemption.

  I agree with Brobjer that Nietzsche presents a “…critique of God & Christianity…” Nietzsche’s critique of Christianity accepts as true that “…the Christian God makes a man smaller.” We find this in Nietzsche’s “Good and Evil” where he states “…the redemption of…becoming Judaized, Christianized, mobized…seems to hinder… man.”(424) Nietzsche’s view on the influence that the church has on man is a view of restriction and inhibition. In addition we see this when Nietzsche claims that, “…the weak and repressed…interprets weakness as freedom…a merit.” If freedom is a merit then it would stands as proof for the rubric established as a definition between good and evil.

• 7    anacabral // May 11, 2009 at 10:55 am

  Edited* (page numbers)

  I agree with Shinn that O’Connor displays that “redemption is possible only through an extreme act, an act of absolute, irrevocable sacrifice.” We find this in O’Connor’s “Everything that rises must converge” when “Julian saw the black fist swing out with the red pocketbook.”(460) Subsequently the same black woman who had punched Julian’s mom responded and said, “He don’t take nobody’s pennies!”(460) This stern statement which was aimed at Julian’s mother redeemed her because neither she nor her son had to tolerate any longer the pity of any white person. This extreme act could have had her jailed but only through this “…irrevocable sacrifice…” could she have a sense of redemption.

  I agree with Brobjer that Nietzsche presents a “…critique of God & Christianity…” Nietzsche’s critique of Christianity accepts as true that “…the Christian God makes a man smaller.” We find this in Nietzsche’s “Good and Evil” where he states “…the redemption of…becoming Judaized, Christianized, mobized…seems to hinder… man.”(424) Nietzsche’s view on the influence that the church has on man is a view of restriction and inhibition. In addition we see this when Nietzsche claims that, “…the weak and repressed…interprets weakness as freedom…a merit.” (433) If freedom is a merit then it would stands as proof for the rubric established as a definition between good and evil.

• 8    Ayana Pena-Espinal // May 11, 2009 at 12:10 pm

  I agree with Brobjer that Nietzche rejects, “The most common dichotomies made in respect to moral judgements is that they must be based on either the consequences of an act or the intentions of the acting person” (Brobjer 64). We find this in, “The source of the concept “good” has been sought and established in the wrong place” (Nietzche 407). Our moral judgements cannot be based on intentions or actions alone.

  I agree with Shinn that O’Connor’s displayed, “Humor is produced by these contrasting elements of realism and violence and their use to express spiritual values” (Shinn 64). We find this in, “Don’t think that was just an uppity Negro woman, that was the whole colored race which no longer take your condescending pennies” (O’Connor 453). The idea of the woman swinging at her and hitting her seemed funny but the reality of it was that someone was finally standing up to the insults of Julian’s mother.

• 9    Crystal // May 11, 2009 at 1:59 pm

  I agree with Shinn that O’Connor’s writing style displays “the grotesqueness of her characters and the violence of their actions are set against a starkly realistic background and related objectively…”(64) We find this in O’Connor’s “Everything that Rises Must Converge” she writes “Julian saw the black fist swing out with the red pocketbook…”(460) Julian’s mother is punched in the face by the woman because she gave her son a penny. This act may seem like an act of kindness but it really upsets the woman because she’s taking it as an insult. This is an example of what was going on during these times with the end of segregation. Her writing is an excellent reflection of the times.

  I agree with Brobjer the Nietzsche displays “Nietzsche’s ethics, unlike almost all thinking about ethics…was not act-oriented but character or person-oriented.” (64) We find this in Nietzshe’s Good and Evil when he says “the judgement ‘good’ did not originate with those to whom ‘goodness’ was shown!” (415) Nietzsche argues that “good” has been defined through out history from the wrong point of view/perspective.

• 10    Esther // May 11, 2009 at 2:18 pm

  I agree with Shinn that O’Connor incorporates her belief that life is “centered in our Redemption by Christ” (60) into her short stories because in “Everything that Rises Must Converge” Julian’s acts of “good” towards his mother are used to portray a payment for all the things that she does for him. The redemptive work of Christ included the sacrificial laying down of His life for the good of all humanity, likewise, Julian’s weekly sacrifice to take his mother to the Y so that her health can be regained and his depressive demeanor is an example what O’Connor writes to show how he looked when “he would be sacrificed to her pleasure” (442).
  I agree with Brobjer that Nietzche’s “person-oriented approach to evaluations and morality is radically different from that of modern moral philosophy” (73). In the essay “Good and Evil” we find that Nietzche’s idea of judging morality is based upon the act that man commits, which differs from that of the “English psychologists” (406) who evaluate morality by “dragging our…inner world into the foreground”(406). The difference between both is that Nietzche’s approach does not regard the motive, which involves the inner being of man while the philosophers link the behaviors of man to the mind, or the soul where all form of behavior originates.

• 11    Norma // May 11, 2009 at 2:27 pm

  I agree with Shinn that O’Connor display”the grotesqueness of her character and the violence of their action are against a starred realistic background”(O’Connor and the grotesque). We find this in ” your great-grandfather had a plantation and two hundred slaves”from (O’Cnnor443). In this quote we can see that Julian’s mother is the one who makes racial distinctions.

  I agree with with Brobjer that Nietzsche’ s display “Both good and evil are necessary in the development of personality “from genealogy . we find this in “with a privilege soul necessarily develop : a development which always run parallel with that other in which “common, ” “plebeian, “low” are finally transformed into the concept “bad”(Nietzsche 409). Nietzsche don’t distinguish class but he constantly refer to how “Good and Evil” display in the human personality.

• 12    Jennae // May 11, 2009 at 2:35 pm

  I agree with Thelma Shinn that Flannery O’Connor “adopts a starkly realistic background (in her stories)”(64).We find this in “Everything that Rises Must Converge,” with the description of the neighborhood in where Julian and his mother live, in addition to the description of Julian’s mother during her stroke. O’Connor states that each house had a narrow collar of dirt around it in which sat, usually, a grubby child.” This image was easy to envision for most in not all people have seen children playing in dirt in front of a home during our lifetime. We also realize how “grubby” they tend to look as they do so. In the case of Julian’s mother’s stroke the ditortion of her body is an actual occurance when many have a stoke. She didn’t creat e a false illness but one that will strick many in their lifetime and causes them to aooear as if “one leg were shorter than the other” and “fiercely distorted” facial apperance.

  I agree with Brobjer that the “chain of causality never ends(64). We find this in “Good and Evil” when Nietzsche argues that the idea of good and evil are different based on the individual doing the “good” or “evil” deed. In response to the nobilty idea of good and evil the priesthood has set its own standard of good and evil. As a result, people are constantly striving to be “moral” which is a denial, according to Nietzsche of natural instinct and behavior thus causing a constant internal battle of mind and will.

• 13    Amelia // May 11, 2009 at 2:36 pm

  I agree with Thelma J. Shinn that O’Connor displays “The grotesqueness of her characters and the violence of their actions are set against a starkly realistic background”(64). We find this when the little boy’s mom reacts in a violent way towards Julian’s mother for offering a bright new penny to the little boy. O’Connor states “Then all at once she seemed to explode like a piece of machinery that had been given one ounce of pressure too much. Julian saw the black fist swing out with the red pocketbook” (452). She doesn’t only turn around and take her son away from Julian’s mom or just make sure the mom knows that she doesn’t want her son accepting charity from her, but uses violence to make her point clear. She doesn’t think twice about swinging at Julian’s mom.

• 14    Renee A. // May 11, 2009 at 2:59 pm

  I agree with Brodjer that Nietzsche exhibits profound critique of morality. “One of the most common dichotomies made in respect to moral judgments is that they must be based on either the consequences of an act or the intentions of the acting person.” (64) We find this in “Good and Evil” when he states The slave revolt in morality begins when resentiment itself becomes creative and gives birth to values: the resentiment of natures that are denied the true reaction, that of deeds, and compensate themselves with an imaginery revenge. While every noble morality develops from a triumphant affirmation of itself, slave morality from the outset says No to what is “outside,” what is ‘different,” what is “not self”…(416,417) Nietzsche makes reference that after complete examination of one’s actions it has to be categorized as “good’ or “evil”. Based upon this categorization it is determined which morality the behavior is derived from. Noble morality consists of Doers, which is what is meant by triumphant affirmations and Slave morality consists of those who receive actions done to them, and reacts as a victim, who then develops resentment. As seen in Flannery O’Connor’s essay Everything that Rises Must Converge in the Characters of Julian (who is of the slave morality) and his mother ( who displays acts of noble morality).

  I agree with Shinn that O’Connor’s writings displays the grotesqueness of her characters and the violence of their actions are set against a starkly realistic background… We find this in her essay Everything that Rises Must Converge when she depicts Julian’s mother as a racist, who because of her upbringing is unable to let go of old school teachings. Although, the slaves have been freed and there are no longer plantations, she sees colored people as being inferior and less worthy of her respect. In the essay Julian’s mother states “With the world in the mess it’s in, it’s a wonder we can enjoy anything. I tell you, the bottom rail is on the top.” Julian quickly reminds her that there are no more slaves her reply is “They were better off when they were”. Her reaction shows that she is unable to accept the cultural changes regarding people of color. No matter how ridiculous others view her rude and obnoxious behavior it reflects what she views as her reality and her norm.

• 15    Amelia // May 11, 2009 at 3:12 pm

  I agree with Thomas H. Brobjer that Nietzsche exhibits “Closely associated to this argument is his view that man is an animal and part of the natural world in which there is no morality” (65). We can find this when he talks about the lamb and the birds of prey and how they may feel about their situation. The lamb who seems to the victim of the birds of prey might say “These birds of prey are evil; and whoever is least like a bird of prey, but rather its opposite, a lamb-would he not be good?”(423). On the other hand the birds of prey reaction would be the whole opposite and they will say “We don’t dislike them at all, these good little lambs’ we even love them: nothing is more tasty than a tender lamb” (423). In reality the lamb is food for the birds of prey and we don’t expect them to have morals or feel guilty for eating the lamb.

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